{
  "founder": "achow101",
  "channel": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "network": "libera",
  "id": "40670b6223c64660bdce259a38494c35",
  "name": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "chair": "achow101",
  "chairs": [
    "achow101"
  ],
  "nicks": {
    "achow101": 52,
    "core-meetingbot": 2,
    "michaelfolkson": 31,
    "S3RK": 25,
    "sipa": 27,
    "kvaciral[m]": 1,
    "gribble": 5,
    "prayank": 3,
    "gene": 9
  },
  "start_time": "2021-07-30T19:04:00+00:00",
  "end_time": "2021-07-30T19:50:18+00:00",
  "active": false,
  "original_topic": "Bitcoin Core development discussion and commit log | Feel free to watch, but please take commentary and usage questions to #bitcoin | Channel logs: http://www.erisian.com.au/bitcoin-core-dev/, http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/ | Meeting topics http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedmeetingtopics.txt / http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedwalletmeetingtopics.txt",
  "current_topic": null,
  "messages": [
    {
      "id": "35a62dd9aee742258a1a40c324716921",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "#startmeeting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "712865aa3dcc463297ebf5339fdb4f46",
      "sender": "core-meetingbot",
      "payload": "Meeting started Fri Jul 30 19:04:00 2021 UTC.  The chair is achow101. Information about MeetBot at https://bitcoin.jonasschnelli.ch/ircmeetings.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5ac3d3bf585d406f95da74f6786509ae",
      "sender": "core-meetingbot",
      "payload": "Available commands: action commands idea info link nick",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "016cf536e6774ccba386d75b554a7340",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "62f7e7b301b5431080120566c980dfb3",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "#bitcoin-core-dev Wallet Meeting: achow101 _aj_ amiti ariard BlueMatt cfields Chris_Stewart_5 darosior digi_james dongcarl elichai2 emilengler fanquake fjahr gleb glozow gmaxwell gwillen hebasto instagibbs jamesob jarolrod jb55 jeremyrubin jl2012 jnewbery jonasschnelli jonatack jtimon kallewoof kanzure kvaciral laanwj lightlike luke-jr maaku marcofalke meshcollider michagogo moneyball morcos nehan NicolasDorier paveljanik petertodd",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d5d0a8f9695a4a35a02a7281b6adfea7",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "phantomcircuit promag provoostenator ryanofsky sdaftuar sipa vasild",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "470b9d3de830429cbd7d28ee3b6c2b85",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "94c98f215db044c9bbdc417dd5e16e38",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "707c4f80ac79444182114be3b1632437",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "any topics to discuss?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "840f4a16a84a4b8d9273abbd89a3bf1d",
      "sender": "kvaciral[m]",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:04:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f4ecad634fc2491a972eca15519022d9",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "I'll ask a couple of questions if there are no topics",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:05:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1c38482be7124911b05b23161ef4852b",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: go ahead",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:05:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "36e1f86907fd400fba795d3b618f73df",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "So there are a couple of PRs #22364 and #19602 making Taproot, bech32m the defaults (and intended to be merged after activation)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:06:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "54805f2655e14d7ebaa7fb2a74eb2b67",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22364 | wallet: Make a tr() descriptor by default by achow101 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #22364 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:06:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d0e57b2b480e40b3a45676b7066101f0",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19602 | wallet: Migrate legacy wallets to descriptor wallets by achow101 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #19602 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:06:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e1396e151dc34d68a6549e2b5941a695",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "These are intended to a version post activation (from what I can understand)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:06:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c825b74e720b4ad799d9815ef22d7292",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "I believe 19602 is unrelated to taproot, no?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:07:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "874356e1ddd744e3a809b88dbd0a9959",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "19602 is unrelated to taproot",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:07:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7fe298be152c47dab51b98213635b353",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Are these dependent on whether other wallets in the ecosystem support Taproot?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:07:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5838e6af12f8476d84f1118c2d88a858",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Oh sorry got wrong PR number, Sjors PR to make bech32m default was supposed to be",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:08:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "da44e9c0ce594cb88b3533ab721b5b24",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: no. the default address type will remain bech32",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:08:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "baa787cc4def4689a904f34891885bbc",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "so p2wpkh will be the default address type",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:08:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "eac5ba7b865940aebaf70c8b639e4d3d",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "#22260 it should have been",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:08:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a44fecc6cb314190af018c6921eb9684",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22260 | Make bech32m the default, except where needed. Update GUI checkbox. by Sjors \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #22260 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:08:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e29d9504964540e0a7882ca69d58f1ba",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "22260 would be dependent on the rest of the ecosystem being able to accept bech32m addresses",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:09:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1e1f75f26858460cb3a8cdcb8a176e27",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Right. And #22364 is in same boat?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:09:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b4db6395610f4ef19a333e666c7bf66e",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22364 | wallet: Make a tr() descriptor by default by achow101 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #22364 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "075c350691fb4f28adc13689e2dd8d73",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Wallets in ecosystem would need to be able to send to P2TR (which hopefully they will)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5e927b08bce34dc59d896c32ef47e350",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "no, 22364 just needs activation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "43cf814f6fde4b32aafdaf42a0ee363f",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "no, that just enables the wallet to construct p2tr addresses",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b169fbd2604b4c7ebbb9d22b12b9fc80",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "it won't create them unless asked to",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5691ab1951e5410c9cf379e7aae2c238",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "22364 give the option for users to make p2tr addresses, but do not give them out by default",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:10:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ba8b64a7d9b64b04bbec703acffde819",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "right now, you need to manually import a tr() descriptor before you can construct p2tr addresses",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:11:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6f16765009d04444a1ebb6bf807f677f",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "I have a related question. What's the path to add tr descriptor to an exisitng wallet?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:11:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4c15d0925ae14291a5257fd49b883e43",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "with 22364, such a tr() descriptor will be created by default",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:11:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "62bff245b7a14e96bce0527cf73f7344",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "with 22364 should also need an option in the GUI which I think can be taken from 22260",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:11:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "054c325a53e94ba5b2c2365e8a084108",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: currently the only way is to use importdescriptors",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "95496e0e4d4e46229fb94690fa08ebba",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Ohh ok. I thought that was making the default descriptor a Taproot descriptor. That is just allowing you to make a Taproot descriptor, gotcha",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "72d40e13f6b04c31a5e3695ae339f10d",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "but I think we should add something (maybe to upgradewallet) that can generate a tr descriptor for the wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "baea276c3f534986983bb53693acf5d6",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "achow101: yes, I was thinking the same",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0a4686adf26c4eda941df67cda4488b3",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "manually constructing tr based on your existing master key is a bit tedious",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "272c1b1cf58e44afbe564713ba8f1b57",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: there is no \"default descriptor\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:12:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "180b262c973b4a728f72b5c0761b87aa",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: there is a default descriptor per address type",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:13:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dfbe33df10724c2582326c1cbba9ee15",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "right now, no default bech32m descriptor is created, so no bech32m addresses can be requested",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:13:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d9031b0bf2e7468c838f95e14216cc1a",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "with 22364, a default bech32m descriptor will be created",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:13:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d3ad2b23487f42ecb518af9f389b8c01",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "(but there will also still be default bech32 and legacy descriptors)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:13:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "092570845d474858b378f2737a3ed964",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Ok thanks",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:14:25+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9f88c49a17144ffb8b3924774f091196",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Then a question on Miniscript (that we discussed at the last wallet meeting)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:15:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dea89da3003648269c8782c92486c9bf",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "achow101: do you have any toughts on how a new command might work? we don't want a command just for the taproot, do we?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:15:15+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a33c59d783fd4673b4672eba33b57e15",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "But I'll wait for above to finish",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:15:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dceeaea6e81d4e0ab4414ac2d69c413e",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: I'm thinking maybe a new RPC for generating descriptors in general",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:15:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "de4810d861544cca9ad792749e3c31ab",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "what's the input for it would look like?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:16:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e6e426dae16d4c199be3e1509b302de9",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "generatedescriptor bech32m",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:16:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7584b0cace724239b4fa5cf18ef8edba",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:16:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fa5f997abc8544f28604d6365934da6a",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: sorry for hijacking your quesitons",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:17:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "02d79ec65d434897b946bc1b2a278c82",
      "sender": "prayank",
      "payload": "getnewdescriptor -tr ?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:17:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "039fea2e30b446eb9da805fe33e17880",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "No it is fine, I'm not only one here :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:17:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e6d67e693bc94e0ead256188101b8e8b",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I think the argument would be the address type, and the descriptor generated depends on whatever the default for the address type we choose",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:17:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7d43d1c5f1534dc98cb7d48346986ed7",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "this would change with future descriptors though",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:17:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "359da5c6ece8451c984a66c18607e82b",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "there's also some issues with sharing the same master private key as other descriptors (or rather lack of)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:18:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "117d1cd9ad3b47edba2010640b2ff757",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: how would it know what key to use?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:18:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "87f8f33896624e16b241445c7165fd64",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "good question",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:18:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9c6bc3d2a1d945edbf9eb64627e85080",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: generate a new one?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:19:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "50461d7fca2042f28b4b1e777c6d8919",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "meh..",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:19:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c2c6bacb8fce4f8494fd379133548da2",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "now when I create new wallet don't I have one master key for all descriptors?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:19:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b273ed2c2f7543d3829b84d6318ed99d",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: i'm mostly asking because i wonder if it could be extended later to help with a multisig workflow",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:19:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b4a381cc6cb1479d8cc0a3273211bb6d",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:19:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9b50914150094a2a9347119d6ad6a611",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "it's really nice to have one master key I think. I'd like to keep that",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:20:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ba102a80bb4841bfb1ef4a6a7e3fdbf8",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: how would that work?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:20:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9135186f93b9434a8421d51916555517",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: i don't really know...",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:20:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "72500dd4e99a422ba7ad7423619c1471",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: after a wallet is created, there isn't really a concept of \"the wallet's master private key\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:20:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bae41d4c9b484f87b04a2bd52fad8936",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "especially if people import things afterwards",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:21:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8a39653aeabf4410af235eb97e71f682",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "yeah, I understand. But I that was the promise of HD",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:21:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "908f67184282445c98404255ba5a8db5",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "the promise of descriptors is also that it doesn't matter",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:22:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e07b356510df49859f15612be4ef8fe6",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "since the key is in the descriptor",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:22:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "80b4af4368804b73bf51038e2f277772",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:22:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e18030e015874a0f89f586cf3f92acd7",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "I kind of agree, but harder to backup and interropability is worse",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:23:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ddcba2528262432588f439d72a3b56c1",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: there could be a second argument that gives the address type to take the master privkey from",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:23:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "08dfa8cc471b47eea5bfc510be3fee40",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "S3RK: well you need to backup either the wallet file, or the descriptors individually",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:23:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9c0d893a109e48e18258650dc7ef9fab",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "just having the key is not enough in any case",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:24:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "52bc464a6e5b4a8c8e94ed98b0c2348c",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "e.g. \"generatedescriptor bech32m bech32\" would mean \"make a descriptor that makes bech32m addresses using the master key from the current active external bech32 descriptor\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:24:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f62f631d574049b9b2c851a8206a0460",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but with a different derivation path?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:24:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7daada58a5934a89a061d76191f82a12",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:24:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e9b6108b0e414a8d91ea029f2f33874c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "how would it figure out what path to use?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:25:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1dd3994455ca42c3a4494702b64c5c05",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "sipa: yes and there is also limited amount of derivations paths. I can just generate descriptors for all of them",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:25:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8974d772c0434f8dad33e0ab8ed3353e",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "S3RK: i really dislike that notion :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:25:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2ac461344f8d4d118d14f9992c7e1efd",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "especially if multisig becomes more common, with individual signers participating possibly in multiple multisigs, you can't just assume you can iterate over all possible derivation paths",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:26:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7165515230944acebc2cb1bd3738b0db",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: I think it would just use the default derivation path. for tr that's in BIP 86",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:26:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "30408f83f45d456f97fd778536712a4b",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "yes, multisig makes everything more complicated",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:26:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1b5c8b91809948169b6012b1edee7554",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: right, fair; perhaps it could check if that some other descriptor already uses that default derivation path",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:27:21+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7e0b95cbcc9d4e3d83188f52bd13c32e",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "if we wanted to be more specific about which descriptor to take things from, we do have a descriptor id thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:28:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "772ef896296144f2bd6c81274ffc6d2f",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "but we might want to formalize descriptor ids before using them",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:29:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4f59c646174d4bbc8cf6aa99b1e46744",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "does the concept of domain separation apply to descriptors?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:29:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "eb90ba8a65524d02815cdf6ac043355e",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "gene: what do you mean by domain separation?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:30:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d72195d9770c4deb927f8fc05121c59b",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "having a specific prefix for derivation paths specific to the use-case",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:31:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3700b692382343f298b469735d81b411",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gene: the point of descriptors is that we can move away from doing that because the derivation paths are explicit in the descriptor",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:32:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "294aa6d3d5724778b38fce7b18806e62",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "there is a notion of an \"account\" in the derivation path. not sure if that's what you want",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:32:19+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cd324f541b104f159189a6866f4202f7",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "not account, more like all tr addrs use m/45' where all normal use m/44'",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:33:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e063e8bd36b54feab9cd214abc411cde",
      "sender": "prayank",
      "payload": "Do we have any transaction on Testnet that has P2TR outputs? If someone tried and has transaction id, please share. I want to check few things in my node, different explorers.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:33:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a822a5d1314f414989778dabdcf13b96",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: we could also make the derivation path be overridden by the user",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:33:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "11d667623352411da9e0154d19766f5b",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "prayank: We do, I'll find you a link",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:33:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "507fc32655904467896972e7052fcd35",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gene: that exists already, see BIPs 44/49/84/86",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:33:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b5cbfb6888374c71b631bce4b0b69f17",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "achow101: thanks +1",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:34:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7cd793952871441293e8d387bf7ea92a",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "sipa achow101: thanks for you ideas. we don't have to solve it now. Let's think about it and check back later",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:34:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4f5ade51d5eb4a2890c70d864f163571",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "right, we still have time",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:35:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "422003facb3246439396ee82bd3be496",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: you had somehing else?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:35:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d49f57c6ed8e414b8496a67161eb2d9f",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Right on Miniscript...",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:35:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e0e795a8afb344b9b6d41cbeecfc0521",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "I know nothing ever is final, final but is Miniscript considered \"final\" now. Time for a BIP etc?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:36:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dd88d5c84f56455c873c94d94a554895",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "There are still small changes being made every now and again",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:36:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e6a8c3d1ee4a4f55a7b0e56fe751cbfb",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "It seems gnarly getting these libraries into Core (Minisketch, Miniscript etc) when Core can change, the PR can change and the external library can change",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:37:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2ac1196ba5bf4840b82b7743220efc94",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Presumably the libsecp approach of keeping it as an external library rather than a subset of it being merged into Core isn't viable",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1d7535288c5b4b4cbf739ed112ce400e",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "looking briefly at rust-miniscript, it seems like changes aren't really being made to miniscript itself but rather to the specific implementation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "33b69d979ddc446d8c607f0263334978",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "And this would be final like Miniscript version 1, obviously Miniscript would change with Taproot etc",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "87a165054c094608b99d33d7628bd304",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i don't tyink the current spec will change anymore",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7d46804ebacc43ea81e222c874683cde",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I think the same can be said of sipa's c++ miniscript implementation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4f1d21e7e27245f995b67cf3ffb609de",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but the c++ miniscript repo isn\"t even up to date with that spec i think",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:38:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0e96296df7494dbe9e704d5641ec2f40",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "of course more extensions can be added",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0d2065786ff34202b012ef90544841ca",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "There are a few issues and open PRs on sipa's C++ implementation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "826b1a13cdbb46569f885b86d09b036e",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "(I think... from memory)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "159a1891d01f4a58bd07c4cf63ea211c",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: is your website still the up to date spec?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a059c67ea0cf4b019741b1e4555f60f7",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "there has been some.more activity recently, so i think we'll be able to make.progress there soonish",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "88a0fa5849e441259f472b72c7dd57e4",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: i don't remember",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5b09630aa2e3481fb5bc33d332f065ed",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "too swapped out...",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:39:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "58c8f95c82bf47189609b237865e52ed",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "(afk)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:40:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6fecb69ba0b34059b2cdab56a3e395a0",
      "sender": "prayank",
      "payload": "michaelfolkson: Thanks :) you can share here. I will check in logs if my IRC app disconnects.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:40:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "adc8de5c0fc24bf0ba3f5cfff8181ae5",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "James' Python implementation has been sitting there for a similar time so it would nice to get a \"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:41:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4ab0571ef55a4534bb2e1d1c6c06d682",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "\"final\" BIP spec",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:41:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fd471bd0ff364115b7d42e8cc29d07b6",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I can ask sanket or andytoshi if either of them would like to write a BIP",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:41:49+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2652ac9f5afe4b58895123e19235608f",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Happy to help (and not be named as a co-author on the BIP)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:42:15+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6bca00a981e74021906e48254b049200",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "If needed",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:42:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "72a3013d58c64eed84908e88e5c4ad67",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "(I expect the only person who is actually fully up to date on all of the particulars is sanket)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:42:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8e09016539bc463d8ade180d85ffb2a1",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "Ok cool, that was my question having glanced over the open Miniscript PR earlier",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:43:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5289cd13ad2e4d83a234c9dbca2231bc",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "anything else to discuss?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:43:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dae95351e69e4af092e63ef240259afc",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "I have one more small question",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:44:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a3577a00ac73437dbe1c6c140be76d86",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "And ideally not 10 BIPs for Miniscript :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:44:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3f9850510d6b4500beb447bb2af950e5",
      "sender": "michaelfolkson",
      "payload": "ducks",
      "action": true,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:44:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "170901da1b154d7f9a5a79cecbe3dc6f",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "how do we decide whether make listing private descriptors a separate RPC? #21500",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:44:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "377ca758631e45a89da770d61ddee2de",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/21500 | wallet, rpc: add an option to list private descriptors by S3RK \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #21500 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:44:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "457d380650b54755bffcb27487c8577c",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: I think that's a personal preference type of thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:45:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "38c5fffdd9c14f0dade518d4585d58f1",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I don't particularly care either way, but it makes sense to continue to just add an option to the existing RPC",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:45:25+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0653095b43594aaa944585f1fc7071ef",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "me too. should I solicit more opinions?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:45:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "68f809efbe0d4339b5c5a140924d672a",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I don't think many people care",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:46:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2a4ce0a2cef648c48c8582563818abf1",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "ok. oh.. one more thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:47:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cee3164763b34d8aaca77f5ace7e91a3",
      "sender": "S3RK",
      "payload": "do we want to consider a CI setup without BDB?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:47:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "43c2fb8fc2cd4b9898a8e71b84cf8582",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "adding a separate RPC could increase security by allowing people to disable it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:47:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "92b515b493904d3983f1cb18f3efd31e",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "S3RK: that would probably be a good idea",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:47:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f8046967a8394dad89f496c66d0c4e2a",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gene: There's currently no way to disable specific RPCs",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:48:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3630fcaac7f24b84a2cad86f4d995e42",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "oh...",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:48:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "71ea0189ffb2420a85183c61f9140eee",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "guessing no way to disable RPC options then either?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:48:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5bdcfba49c034e49870e016890ecc8e6",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "that's correct",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:48:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b3eb571816cb424997a98644c57bd1e5",
      "sender": "gene",
      "payload": "may look into how much work it would be to add that feature",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:49:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f0b4a6e7c17c4937bbf9e81c052c19fc",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "anything else?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2021-07-30T19:50:03+00:00"
    },
    {
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