{
  "founder": "wumpus",
  "channel": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "network": "freenode",
  "id": "a619acfb824e498686839d4dbee9bdc5",
  "name": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "chair": "wumpus",
  "chairs": [
    "wumpus"
  ],
  "nicks": {
    "wumpus": 46,
    "lightningbot": 2,
    "sipa": 67,
    "elichai2": 14,
    "achow101": 32,
    "jonasschnelli": 22,
    "jonatack": 1,
    "hebasto": 2,
    "jkczyz": 1,
    "aj": 1,
    "MarcoFalke": 8,
    "sdaftuar": 1,
    "cfields": 8,
    "amiti": 1,
    "jnewbery": 1,
    "bitcoin-git": 5,
    "gribble": 2,
    "promag": 1,
    "jarthur": 1,
    "luke-jr": 15,
    "jeremyrubin": 2,
    "instagibbs": 11
  },
  "start_time": "2020-04-09T19:00:05+00:00",
  "end_time": "2020-04-09T20:01:06+00:00",
  "active": false,
  "original_topic": "Bitcoin Core development discussion and commit log | This is the channel for developing Bitcoin Core. Feel free to watch, but please take commentary and usage questions to #bitcoin | Channel logs: http://www.erisian.com.au/bitcoin-core-dev/, http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/ | Meeting topics https://gist.github.com/moneyball/071d608fdae217c2a6d7c35955881d8a",
  "current_topic": "deprecating signrawtx RPCs (achow101)",
  "messages": [
    {
      "id": "4407a52663f341a2b723afeb55e8cd94",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#startmeeting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "aacb1a9d03db47e2b937fe131f89e721",
      "sender": "lightningbot",
      "payload": "Meeting started Thu Apr  9 19:00:05 2020 UTC.  The chair is wumpus. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d3397b417a6944989b83fb8472b89f55",
      "sender": "lightningbot",
      "payload": "Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e0924f82c05a4f6f9149445c2858c5b8",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "07d2b7169a814b20a6a14fb156cd6414",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d5e6f2f542e04ff8ba81a343438bf7ba",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag provoostenator aj Chris_Stewart_5 dongcarl gwillen jamesob ken281221 ryanofsky gleb moneyball kvaciral ariard digi_james amiti fjahr",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5ca16250336343e48baad9e6f4946c8a",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "jeremyrubin lightlike emilengler jonatack hebasto jb55",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ef964175127143bbad88f57b5f4855f4",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fe4427e7d764426dabc7463b9e36cb37",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "437fd53c15924ff1b2c8e86d69d28834",
      "sender": "jonatack",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bcd5b639e57045e99cde47332df81d0b",
      "sender": "hebasto",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "82ba8cbee3a64224acebd11087a50806",
      "sender": "jkczyz",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0d7f25ef49a5483fa2daff1e0f9b005a",
      "sender": "aj",
      "payload": "hola",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "34eacd331a524271936ab684aecd120a",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dfb5e6eb5d50462883391c6f7b9f235c",
      "sender": "sdaftuar",
      "payload": "hi!",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "727dcbd670174565b6a1f75497c45b0b",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "(sorry, merge bot incoming in a few secs)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "29ee3d427b704477af1eeed0c301230d",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ca09a6307eb04a7cbe0d24829d413505",
      "sender": "amiti",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a546e43558264ed78768831bd88ccb7f",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "any proposed topics?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:01:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0c752ca9ebb6488eb1319e6f6619dbbd",
      "sender": "jnewbery",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fa3910713fdb407ca142d97a1400e9ff",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "wen release?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8c9d4e20f5514d63a5bc5d5e1551b6d0",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "looks like there's one by achow101: deprecating signrawtx RPCs",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "27c872f812d149a283a81313b89b4790",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "low priority topic if there's time: future of asmap?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ea3aab7ce0de485794709ddb60be1e09",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "MarcoFalke:depends on whether  #18553 is a blocker",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0b2eff35066a413ba5acae64f4a8b6b1",
      "sender": "bitcoin-git",
      "payload": "[bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 6 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/081dcbde6623...405713d00fb4",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a9ad04878316414b952ddb274aed7918",
      "sender": "bitcoin-git",
      "payload": "bitcoin/master 5560845 Pieter Wuille: Make a fuzzer-based copy of the prevector randomized test",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6a2109f42be848c3875c6d5eb7bd78eb",
      "sender": "bitcoin-git",
      "payload": "bitcoin/master eda8309 Pieter Wuille: Assert immediately rather than caching failure",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ede4b12da0c542d28b183c52a18a984d",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18553 | Avoid non-trivial global constants in SHA-NI code by sipa \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #18553 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d433da081d3e4c1bae6a1858650a124b",
      "sender": "bitcoin-git",
      "payload": "bitcoin/master 402ad5a Pieter Wuille: Only run sanity check once at the end",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "304c3b2d9ec649a5bc1daa51d72af3e9",
      "sender": "bitcoin-git",
      "payload": "[bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #18529: Add fuzzer version of randomized prevector test (master...202004_prevector_fuzz) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/18529",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4a0b182ab6bc42c99e3530de7dc4a4bc",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "rc1 soon?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:03:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9aa3481510d044209dfdfbaf7765fd3d",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "I wish rebroad could ACK it, since they reported the issue",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:03:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "58aab1d1fae64479befd9f16d7e3fc19",
      "sender": "hebasto",
      "payload": "why 18553 could be a blocker?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:03:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d9b838adc1084d36beea85d11e72b243",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "it's the only PR left that is tagged for 0.20",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:03:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5408ceadb78146deb8d558679d0f80dc",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "hebasto: because if your system doesn't support the instruction it'll just crash before main()",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:03:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bb32b854bf5641558046756df77b6839",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "Does anyone have that CPU to test?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9b5ac1c01a074abd9696f73c3388b4b0",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "MarcoFalke: I'm surprised this is the first time we're hearing about this issue. I would've thought everyone without SSE* support will get this error",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "858850fa913745a2acbb00f5cd4373f2",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i'm not sure the problem will appear in every build (it may be compiler dependent)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9721d83df2ff434196afb62842995b9c",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "no, bitcoind master runs fine even on my oldest pc, but it might depend on compiler too",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b1fbfeb3238947e590ee6f8d5c77e119",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "would i understand how our existing code is broken for systems that do not have sse4",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0e758cc371c14889a26f28c9c62eef1f",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "*but i understand",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:04:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8f91f92dbbc3457cb88194f2b14af9a9",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "movaps is SSE2, right?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:05:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d58cf50b777e4e008d714301e36579f0",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:05:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "59672aadbaeb45fbbe20fcad3ebed67d",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "if the init code contained *SSE4* oh sure we'd have noticed",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:05:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "06fbcf4f7e1d40d08c9a7f03f03e38a0",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "*sse2",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:05:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6ca69592081f4d22add1355143a6f496",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "wumpus: right",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:05:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7227b8b5bc124f70a3037ff20d6182b0",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i suspect he is executing an sse4 instruction",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6daf34ce1f3a43ce95eba38848f7decf",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "almost(?) all amd64 processors support SSE2",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "76fc1a11de964347b72783c24d641e16",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "because his system has sse2",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a9048b04043140dc8e6b3673eb5057b7",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "oh",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a5692c7a01c646dfaf022f55781986e0",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "okay in that case we don't know if the PR fixes theproblem at all",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "28a9d889120e40d0be8a16a2738f4d21",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "it does",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6c0ec5d879a249acaa58ac5cf563c426",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I suggest we just move on with the branch-off and rc1",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3b4256593bd941b29dde6f24cae8cb26",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "ah, I guess if we're targetting sse4 it's free to ignore the sse2 intrinsic. Annoying that those are only hints.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:06:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bd186025b90240dab984554f53653ddb",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "wumpus: the sha256-shani module is compiled with sse4 on, so any code the compiler produces in that module is allowed to have sse4 instructions",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bc2add24e6984f3bbf4ca11339009c5a",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "the fact that it has a global initializer is a bug regardless",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "90e37f05d3144bfbb933227dd1e22431",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "sipa: yes, I agree",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4cabec5d0cf64ba994c8729e2be6e6fc",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I'm the person who ACKed that PR, I think it's a good change",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "17281947a891480c8e82fc22b2bb4abe",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "anyways the current code is somewhat broken",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a4548312e6c54f9ba24a5c67fd21988c",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "even if that's not his specific problem",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:07:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c0db8fa3aca745608d9ef54464b772d2",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "we don't know the exact conditions to reproduce it (which is hard, as it's compiler dependent), but i believe my PR is a bugfix independently of that",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:08:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bf973709cec040358f649b66a327d412",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "sipa: exactly",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:08:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5b97f50071d8429eb271464484a0e842",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:08:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2b69a3a5075e44f897953bca9294acb1",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "it makes sense no matter what",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:08:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bed7cee0743448eb91f03c46af494be6",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "even reduces code size a bit",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:08:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bf9eeb21934d4ee881c27f070725dd08",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but if we want to make sure rebroad's issue is fixed in 0.20... we have no choice but to wait for him",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5141eda3825d449c836bd96941f849a8",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i think we can do that in rc1",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6ec1173414284682b4da2d5a18079185",
      "sender": "jarthur",
      "payload": "If anyone needs time on a machine w/ hardware SHA-NI for profiling/memory sanitization, send me your SSH pubkey and I'll give you a VM",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d2e7ce61ba744c59b6358682cfff5725",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i have one too",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "569fe90d8907466e80a20eff63c8f8d3",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I'm not going to hold up rc1 on them testing it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "02ca2a7e0248476583f56f0a92f5ec34",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "a machine without sse4 would be more useful :p",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:09:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cab6036f7327479897929b496e128e25",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "(proposed topic: change destdata)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:10:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "598bf46ab3904347950ae7de9148df31",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "there are very few x86_64 systems without sse4 i think",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:10:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2d43ec41c06547899f4a98ee296e9d87",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "although maybe better for wallet meeting tomorrow",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:10:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "54ef978beb9549f582ce05efc5eeb3fa",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "true, even my old dev machine has \"sse4a\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:10:21+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2286180d515b4dc4893c7152712d6b9f",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "(but does relate to 0.20)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:10:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a939b1457660402aaf69d0ecdb2fd77a",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "jarthur: I would like to run some UB sanitizer on the patch, just because I'm a bit uncomfortable with C++'s alignment rules",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:12:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "11eff01f37dd4a2a8dacafba853d6484",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "in that case, let's do rc1 without it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9962589095b346509d921bacbe7d7c56",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "ack",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "81245c055d6a43dbbbee40105a9d8ed0",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "elichai2: if you're that uncomfortable, there's an intrinsic that doesn't require alignment.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "828c79d45efa490f8a0c6e5d413cdf90",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "should probably get at least #18572 into 0.20",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fe1d4e1f2e774eb9b64eda00ef1ab320",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18572 | Wallet: Accept \"changedata\" db key as an alias to \"destdata\" by luke-jr \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #18572 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "87d4f5cbcef945eca3930bd031bdeebf",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "compiler might even auto-upgrade it?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a0cdbfe382d14d70a1577dff61d04218",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "cfields: i don't think it can",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:14:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "41403f9707c44321b266fa26836c9f5c",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "the current solution has 0 overhead at least",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:14:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f35c6dad151d41dc9770dca5081d8ccc",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "cfields: I'm not saying it's UB/ID just that I don't know the rules well enough :) I assume the unaligned load is costlier",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:14:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c2d4d1049dbd46a3bb8c0a6cd275c637",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "elichai2: on most systems they have the same cost, but not all",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:14:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cea9d744733f4ef983eddb7a686e6325",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "it even generates the same code as before",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:14:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "59950ff5c7414fd891f13fe69d9b07a7",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "sipa: I thought SIMD instructions do require aligned pointers. unlike regular loads/stores",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c833458a86fe40feb8ec5fa9a93c8e85",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "(x86/x86_64)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "18e3f09838d6446d98d3d089f896aa3e",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "yeah, I'm not really understanding the concern. We use alignment tricks in sse4 as well.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "43d53c0588d14b34908712448c52efbe",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "elichai2: correct",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cc408388efb64623bedf36eb7ae917b2",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "depends on the CPU in my expereince",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "11c6e365b55c465a9780a8c77d64765e",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes, alignas(__m128i) should just work",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6e05dd292a774ad0bc3536a09c7811b1",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "elichai2: movdqa requires alignment, movdqu does not",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:15:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4daadbe47df74698aa5540a86bb42717",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "Ok, if other people are confident in this than I'm ACK too",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:16:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "75dc112446b64f299482d5d38e0198c2",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "for a long time at least, Mesa and glibc used ssse3 for memcpy-type stuff, even when unaligned - and it broke on (IIRC) Sandy Bridge",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:16:15+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ea091a0af8c94ac79d42af9a9ee65fa1",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but still on most systems they have the same cost; the distinction was made because on early CPUs they differed",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:16:15+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "50e8d0f921404c9483a2053cfe8294d3",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "we use alignas() in a few other places too",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:17:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7479c69f02fd49149ce6dfbc62009a5d",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "if the compier ignores it, we're screwed with regard to UB in either case",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:17:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a650f02973534df1aabd4439f3048894",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "yeah, i'm not worried about the alignment thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:17:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "feca0978b8374f1ab0d25c92fd3d8695",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "(prevector comes to mind)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:17:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9a90940abeb547c7900131ec11214a7a",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "wasn't there a UB in a version of prevector?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:19:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f25f9d1596094923b270c1b9c4961039",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes, that was solved using the current explicit construction",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:19:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "632da7cf406f41edb70c72911be68a8c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "elichai2: the kind of technically-UB-by-the-C++-spec-but-not-on-any-real-platform one only, afaik",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:19:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "48013d2d513d4c24a5b7d75494913feb",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "it wasn't alignas()'s fault",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:20:04+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e099a36346cd4e06a5b1a14b2edc21ca",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "isn't that the worse kind? :P",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:20:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7da132f97f144f028e91eea8e195e49e",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "elichai2: i think bugs that affect production code are just *slightly* more serious",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:20:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3295d0f135ed4d8c8a5c9bb713db9eb1",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "right it's a pragma thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:20:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fb0598b8e8cb42d7a4f159f4bd1eb42f",
      "sender": "elichai2",
      "payload": "anyhow, we're talking about this too much :) I'm ACK if people feel confident, my lack of understanding shouldn't stop anything",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f6f75d4965eb4eb69b2cc53e5d7dea8a",
      "sender": "jeremyrubin",
      "payload": "just noting that there is a pragma free version of prevector that could be written and has no UB; but it's a bigger refactor",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "05565efd55574bbcaa7d1dfc318b4159",
      "sender": "cfields",
      "payload": "elichai2: nothing wrong with being paranoid.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6314aa733cdf4a8cab2bc6afaefc540a",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "of course",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cbddcdb07a46410580bd50643a585a28",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#topic deprecating signrawtx RPCs (achow101)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b8b42a87c3bc4ea6b5d4755abb5e0f11",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "jeremyrubin: we're not discussing refactoring prevector again :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:22:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "58a94e65d15f4204a39a3fd5098b9b8c",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "so multisig signrawtransaction workflows don't work with descriptor wallets",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c70aacbeba1d4c64af4d099ac75975bd",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I was thinking that because we have psbt now, we should deprecate the signrawtx RPCs",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2fc2c1a15d4f4e8baa00d30d9dab4e0f",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "completely or only for multisig?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bbef4c16273c453bb873993f7859085f",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "can you quickly elaborate why it won't work with desc. wallets?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b658980a01c442f8aa3d61faabdf16b0",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I'm not generally in favor of depracating signrawtx RPCs, many people use the raw transactions workflow",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6844e3d43be147ba9f93aa3ad3cd2e64",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "it should be a longer deprecation cycle because it's so widely used",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "eaa780611a284fd0a403ed2a9c840ac6",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "if we do it should be *very* well documented first",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:23:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "007277149fe848e88eace9941b02ef01",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i'm not so convinced here",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "88f4e263a1c64df095328024eb04cbff",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "agree with wumpus",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "aaa17ef148454cf389a58b248765fc9c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i believe it's good to \"nudge\" people towards PSBT, but deprecation is probably too hard a hammer for that",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "91d3c761c5c9469faa600744f5bd9c65",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "[19:23:38] <jonasschnelli> can you quickly elaborate why it won't work with desc. wallets?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5175131fa7794dc6a6e0b7d8d48ad178",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "like make a blog post how to *old thing* in *new way*",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2aa16c2766004920ac89d8320e713fa5",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: because of the separation of watchonly things, currently we can't create a wallet that has both the multisig script and keys to sign for it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bd5175e95536477cbc6e0938d6d25f45",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes, I agree",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1b95bb3fcb0b44468556163b571460d3",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "so doing a multisig becomes a half assed psbt workflow",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:24:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f5edaebf45e74484904addc0e510c40c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: i don't understand why we'd want descriptor wallets to not support private keys for multisig",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:25:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cfb02002aadf4c43accab5e74960ddf6",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: the issue is with exporting the private keys to the multisig",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:25:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d38dc629ff7f4c8d88d10a3f6e24c16b",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "IIRC there was contention about exporting keys that used unhardened derivation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:25:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "12bd3e602e5147eaa36914e804b3601d",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "are those technical or conceptual limitations?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:26:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "57d2a2adf3fd42f4aea223ea6c919bfd",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: so use hardened derivation?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:26:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "83217fd5de774b69a8b09581a8f2081f",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: conceptual and current implementation limitations",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:26:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c48d8dbd948941bda0949c34c656f2c2",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i understand there may be UI issues on how to make this easy",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:26:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9a74a27bd2b94d4c92251dcbcdebdb8c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but say you have a private key, even generated manually or whatever... you should be able to import a descriptor for a multisig based on it, and have that private key in the same wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:27:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "131038e599ad4c6595720cec40a76dd3",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: sure",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:28:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "06c02b20622d41ddadb65590a749e178",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "and that would work fine with signraw*, right?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:28:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cf931e64a5cb4c9891876936dc70efce",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "(this is also partly in the context of making all of the RPC tests work)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:28:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ec0cffa7b2df4aa781a227a86df6a734",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:28:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9e5f86d3fe674c9b8f406566940bc988",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "ok",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:29:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "467785ff30b74cc8b0e2faa80b64ed59",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "but conceptually, it feels like psbt should be a directly replacement to raw txs, so we should move to remove those eventually",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:30:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ced860461762449fb43062e7a031c9f5",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I could understand why the signraw commands could refuse to work for BIP44-ish descriptor wallets (due to the hardening violation),... though for manual privkey-ckd it should work",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:30:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9d3092eb3b5b4f0d86591f68df29a392",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: once you have all the right things in a descriptor wallet, it doesn't matter - hardened or not",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:30:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5d967159662246c8ac979dc2756d68a6",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "(is my understanding)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:31:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e393dabe1f0b43298549e55f6c852abf",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: i think my preference would be to mark signraw* as in \"maintenance mode\" or so, where they don't receive new features (e.g. they wouldn't support taproot signing when that gets in)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:31:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b6d422185d134c47abbfdf49dcf3b7c4",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "+1",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "275285aad5a94836ad93a110290d20e3",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but i feel like deprecation is kind of ruthless",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b3d4745c465d40eb87a87182a87f5ace",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I was thinking of an extra long deprecation cycle",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "73a7562b5bb2437c8ef6dc6c15d59232",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f0863b9c012c48f8a855a739407e5197",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "imo I think the tooling is too widely used and PSBT still has an adoption curve to hit",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f9bfda38853746f4b0e305d9c56e2d63",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "agree",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:32:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "80b2b6ceaafd4bc3bb1c8f8afeb7cad6",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "like 2 releases with a note saying it's deprecated, but don't disable yet. then 2 releases with it hidden behind -deprecatedprc. then remove",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:33:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4b77e7ccc9004c0db07630898f33dc9f",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "the tooling meaning *raw*",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:33:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dc0cc9e4b1bf4fffbfd5966a2eedfc20",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "maybe in a few years bring this up again :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:33:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "520ffd154cbe47e7bcfa16ea759471bb",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "adds to 2022 calendar",
      "action": true,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:34:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "312763cb47be41249a0b91238ce73bcf",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I can't completely follow why we should remove/deprecate it since in many use cases those commands work fine.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:34:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "01842cf2ef264ed29e6b04fe3ad22d55",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "(the accounting system had conceptual flaw in contrast)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:34:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e73c57f100e14977835cd2e5f7ace329",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "*flaws",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "018bcf07ea174d59839fe437477e3b2a",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: what flaws?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "761a8054c59e4cb494d560d7ee2a86e5",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3ff3b0b0b0c14afcbc0aa8cd21ec8960",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: i think the reasoning is \"it's hard to make it work nicely with descriptors, and there is a better system already... would be easy to just get rid of it\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "22e2f7ccf8fe46bf93eb3a3c3a123859",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "the accounting system worked fine AFAIK, just nobody cared to maintain it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4dfa127055d34bc383890e09b51a5051",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "accounting system discussion is off topic",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2c0b8ffa11ec49c69d43b715405d1a84",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "true",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:35:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3ac45c27fe79472cb1b611863e63ced8",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "couldn't signrawtx be reimplemented as a wrapper around PSBT?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9c63f7096d2c47e0bdc58287943cee5f",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "is the plan to only support descriptor wallets in the future?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c7b925f98d6b44d089a13543bd6c187c",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "with some sort of migration",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4afe656de51043448486bf4ba96c3cea",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "luke-jr: yes (and probably should), but that wouldn't solve the problem",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d18aa610e76f424ab5a73ecf60051309",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "my plan is to make descriptor wallets the default wallet type",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1898d21adcf04ab4b87162ac68008572",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "eventually",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6df4b03feeb8410aabb5214bc2a688f6",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "this would be fine. As long as \"legacy\" wallets are still supported, signwith* commands shound't go away?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:36:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cdd1ce7c86a1400e96b7c4e295f23de7",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "the issue (as i understand it) is constructing a descriptor wallet that has all the same pieces of information as a current legacy wallet is unclear (where do the keys come from, how to import without reintroducing mixed wallets or watching the wrong kind of things...)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:37:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4068ecd444234e378e89af30fcbd6487",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "sipa: yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:37:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "79d39beacb734fd6b51f82312532f705",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i believe it would be nice to spend some time on actually solving that... because there is no technical reason why a descriptor wallet couldn't have that information",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b9626837f85c403f833270700a96163f",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "exactly",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9a6702ba25fc41aca5b5b4ea3875198b",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "achow101: FWIW, i think your envisioned workflow (having two wallets, one with the multisig, and one with the private keys) is also pretty suboptimal",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a60c0721d3b24afcbbac82a3fdb4d937",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "we shouldn't enforce modes of use due to solvable technical imitations",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bda4f6750b374e28af1f6f88a7e0c862",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "If the call doesn't work with descriptor wallets, it should be disabled for those wallets, not for legacy wallets as well.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "def1e9895e524e7a8f55de971cdad215",
      "sender": "MarcoFalke",
      "payload": "agree with jonasschnelli",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7f7182a68d944ccf920f589ef44fee6e",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "it isn't a technical limitation",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:38:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "32a97c79e1c14fbfacebde8720f4f354",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "it's an unsolved UI question",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:39:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "da473c1824c543b99838e6a41d755cc2",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "(where UI includes RPC and workflows)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:39:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f0fdba477049443d8d99512a7fab6bce",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "i suppose it is",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:42:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9d1ee2d5de214b55aca6294efac2bd0d",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i don't think disabling signraw* for descriptor wallets would even solve the root of the issue - users would still need a workaround to do what they could before (having two wallets, and run PSBT RPCs on both)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:42:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f0257257a4644bf4bae71ed176a513dc",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "achow101: maybe you could write a short gist/paper about the issue for help us to understand it better?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:43:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "399da813379d4ed18986e40d7728a54b",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "can i try in 3 lines?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:43:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "159901551a8449979e4c65d5dca5f8e5",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "plz",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:43:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "270506f508a346ae94425fefb27cc330",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: sure. I should write release notes for descriptor wallets anyways and there should be section on known limitations",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:43:49+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c7fb1e9883644f119627daf418823c5a",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "+1",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:44:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6bf799e3f0a54516a3a94dfdeabdc001",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "currently you can construct a legacy wallet which has (1) a private key for one key and (2) watchonly records for multisigs involving that public key - this is crazy (because it means payments to the individual single key will be treated as incoming money, unable to separate it from the multisig funds), but it works great: you have the script information (the the multisig watchonly) and the private",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:45:04+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bfacb5bddc454f36b7f009d1f77419cd",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "key for one of the keys in one wallet,...",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:45:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d028e5f708e4483d9d11c0e03f7d510c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "so it can do everything",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:45:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0b48782339cb4b79b8a72e3ecf8cea5b",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "in descriptor wallets, you'd need to explicitly import a descriptor for the multisig, and then add a private key for one - you can't have started with a wallet that had that private key already as a single-key wallet (because then you reintroduce the mixing of singlekey/multisig funds), and you can't export that private key from another wallet (because we don't want export of non-hardened keys)....",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:46:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a4d01ce24ba945868b54ec1d542c3d53",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "so where does it come from?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:47:04+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7728380316b344a3b12670474db8bc5f",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "i think the only question is a UX one around construction of such wallets",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:47:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "994cb99f112342bd87752b948564ace0",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "</fin>",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:47:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5c8b364fcbfc440caeed1d1728ff00d4",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I see. So one would need a watch-only-ms desc wallet and a single-key desc wallet for signing the PSBT (or whatever)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:48:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f212707ef2654ed2839ef382d0e6f720",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:48:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a7ad1c69b8bd4279a9d966a31a53d145",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "and with both psbt and raw tx, the workflow is the same",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:48:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b6bb76eb7cdf47f89a0b7776b6c923ae",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "right, that would work - and the PSBT would carry the script information from the watch-only-ms wallet to the signing-key wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:48:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0dac62e7eb98439c9bc888468df74d4e",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "user stories may help cover cases, I tend to only think about MY use case",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:49:04+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ab56087db1bb4117b518b4108d6e9acf",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Which the signraw commands could construct in the background (assume providing all the infos)?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:49:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "be468f0b27474af9813ad04daec5fd83",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "aren't the multisig funds classified as watchonly?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:49:21+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9a6c5790939d45efb95954496ab031ec",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "luke-jr: right, fair - that's the reason watchonly exists",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:49:53+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dcf5a33d911c4053954e97c53faeb93e",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "you go to the watch-only-ms wallet with a psbt or rawtx, it adds the scripts. then you go to the single-key wallet and sign it. it's the same workflow, but psbt is better suited for carrying this data",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:49:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d801a3b88975406ca42852baeb3c192c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "but it's ridiculous that you currently can't do multisig stuff without also having payments to individual keys as balance in your wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:50:14+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f9247728b8b84007bd61ac1778b2f71c",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "sipa: though that is rarely used, right?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:50:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8a4f9f9557b2490084f071299e13368b",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: \"used\" ?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:50:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b646f77b8f174b9881c6a3dbb54898d5",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "it's an attack",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:50:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "77c613c73ca34e64a062d8d1783b4b5c",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "you can send funds to a individual key in a multisig, and the user may think it's paid to the multisig",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b7b44eef89e1435793efccfd02aab2d6",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "so we need a way to have can-sign non-ismine descriptors",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "78fef18cb5644b7ca52d0b35d58c9b99",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Kida. Yes. I see. Agree that it is a flaw/ridiculous",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d920a019fb6749638051835960cbfcd4",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "luke-jr: descriptor wallets already do that",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a56e1d867282487e9f7a634b7a9287cb",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "luke-jr: we already do that. it's a question of the scripts",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f5bc9a6151e242f1a2237dc6def1923e",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "we just need a good way to import a multisig descriptor + individual key into a descriptor wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "37d5a345b59848bea7e2006892b75f7b",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "IsMine implementation in descriptor is a relative beauty :P",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:51:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bf1deb0304fc47abae23930552edd359",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "if that works, signraw* and PSBT* will function just as before",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:52:25+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "62d2695fc8964c0ea1036f3cd4b5a4ea",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "if that doesn't work, it's going to be shitty to use for both",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:52:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "688f48cfe8744283926a08cba55a3bc7",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Now I see why it's a UX issue. We have set our own limitations which IMO could be worked around by creating the right structures on the fly for the signraw* commands when using desc.-wallets",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:52:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0ea4fd7f665c426abaca642bbb0dd331",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "achow101, if you do this you're also going to have to get rid of the \"private keys disabled\" hack we've been using",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:53:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0833b4c6099c4f448a454e9a31781c49",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "to detect if we want to do PSBT stuff or try to sign the transaction",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:53:25+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "619473bca5194430929567a0f7200dd9",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "instagibbs: I don't think so. but I'll experiment",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:54:19+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0303df09cc614aa794c016c73084b5bb",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: which \"right structures\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:54:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8360b18025a649d396c93c65bf8c9053",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "achow101, well, if there exists a private key, it will try to sign and fail unexpectedly, I think, but you can test yes :)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:54:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "43ec883e89cf4d88a410de138ffb0631",
      "sender": "jeremyrubin",
      "payload": "BTW: if you have thoughts on BIP-119 Next Steps please submit them in this survey; want to collect feedback from everyone https://forms.gle/rT3v4JjHbdn3RMnL6",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:56:04+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "efe6807e147e40f8936137727486bcc8",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "The wallet should just probably know explicitly that it should try to auto-sign or return a PSBT, but that's yet another UX q.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:57:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7110c1d53bfa4608b29170d61c83d6ef",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "3 minutes to go",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:57:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8a8c2d3473c44608813c87d2dd144151",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "achow101: maybe I get it wrong. But if someone invokes a signraw, depending on the input, you could create either a watch-only-ms wallet or a single-privkey wallet in the background and use the PSBT workflow",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:57:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bf459d4c20b74064aec8193bb9080ec9",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "but where does the multisig script come from?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:58:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "493c10e8d7404190aba9c68e1ee29743",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: the question is not about signraw* or PSBT*; the question is constructing a wallet that has the right information",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:59:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "652af7b2e9c44d6880ba4ae9073783c4",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "it's not hard to wrap signrawtx around psbts so it uses psbt internally. but it just doesn't have all of the data there",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:59:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "31df3b8d2b8a45d4be082be96d5dc205",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "descriptor wallets can or can't have multiple descriptors?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:59:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c6a2ec7322e142caa4947d64789401c2",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "provide it manually or provide it via a second wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:59:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "22ade856df844e519be9dbaa2dd75392",
      "sender": "sipa",
      "payload": "luke-jr: can; change and payments in general will come from distinct descriptors",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:59:55+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9db7e630e52344518fdcb44fd192d6a8",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "luke-jr, you can import any number of descriptors, there are 6 \"Active\" ones, aka keypool, by default",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "66164fa0f35b4e7bb21bf264850cb74d",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "luke-jr: can, but having a descriptor wallet contain both multisig and single key descriptors goes back to the mixed watchonly wallet thing",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e93a8c0692114d5d95c923343742b261",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "legacy/p2sh-segwit/bech32 x internal/external",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bc7695752f3a466cb8950b361df1a068",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "achow101: not if you flag the single-keys descriptor as non-ismine?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:49+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d70bc098cf804b01a2e6511aa46d9a75",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "sorry, time to wrap up the meeting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ab4ae96fc7f14d4596bf1eab51c00c6d",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: yes, and that's the shitty ux sipa was talking about",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:00:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ed5884573d0f443db7c06a1f3a17b4f6",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#endmeeting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:01:06+00:00"
    }
  ],
  "events": [
    {
      "event_type": "START_MEETING",
      "message": {
        "id": "4407a52663f341a2b723afeb55e8cd94",
        "sender": "wumpus",
        "payload": "#startmeeting",
        "action": false,
        "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:00:05+00:00"
      },
      "operand": null,
      "id": "4407a52663f341a2b723afeb55e8cd94",
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    {
      "event_type": "LINK",
      "message": {
        "id": "ede4b12da0c542d28b183c52a18a984d",
        "sender": "gribble",
        "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18553 | Avoid non-trivial global constants in SHA-NI code by sipa \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #18553 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
        "action": false,
        "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:02:33+00:00"
      },
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    {
      "event_type": "LINK",
      "message": {
        "id": "fe1d4e1f2e774eb9b64eda00ef1ab320",
        "sender": "gribble",
        "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18572 | Wallet: Accept \"changedata\" db key as an alias to \"destdata\" by luke-jr \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #18572 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
        "action": false,
        "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:48+00:00"
      },
      "operand": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18572",
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      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:13:48+00:00"
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    {
      "event_type": "TOPIC",
      "message": {
        "id": "cbddcdb07a46410580bd50643a585a28",
        "sender": "wumpus",
        "payload": "#topic deprecating signrawtx RPCs (achow101)",
        "action": false,
        "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:50+00:00"
      },
      "operand": "deprecating signrawtx RPCs (achow101)",
      "id": "cbddcdb07a46410580bd50643a585a28",
      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T19:21:50+00:00"
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    {
      "event_type": "END_MEETING",
      "message": {
        "id": "ed5884573d0f443db7c06a1f3a17b4f6",
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      "timestamp": "2020-04-09T20:01:06+00:00"
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  "aliases": {},
  "vote_in_progress": false,
  "motion_index": null
}