{
  "founder": "wumpus",
  "channel": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "network": "freenode",
  "id": "7ef68a2c4981485f8f67ea2437f97c2a",
  "name": "#bitcoin-core-dev",
  "chair": "wumpus",
  "chairs": [
    "wumpus"
  ],
  "nicks": {
    "wumpus": 43,
    "lightningbot": 2,
    "moneyball": 1,
    "meshcollider": 2,
    "jonasschnelli": 21,
    "jamesob": 5,
    "promag": 11,
    "instagibbs": 2,
    "gribble": 13,
    "phantomcircuit": 2,
    "achow101": 16,
    "luke-jr": 4,
    "gmaxwell": 24,
    "ryanofsky": 1
  },
  "start_time": "2019-01-03T19:01:48+00:00",
  "end_time": "2019-01-03T19:39:03+00:00",
  "active": false,
  "original_topic": "Bitcoin Core development discussion and commit log | This is the channel for developing Bitcoin Core. Feel free to watch, but please take commentary and usage questions to #bitcoin | Channel logs: http://www.erisian.com.au/bitcoin-core-dev/, http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/ | Meeting topics https://gist.github.com/moneyball/071d608fdae217c2a6d7c35955881d8a",
  "current_topic": "having users create their wallets instead of automatically creating a default wallet (achow101)",
  "messages": [
    {
      "id": "a1be82e2fec9418497f715740ef8c157",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#startmeeting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:01:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c20c261abf744d82bfcb4d47f5ef4375",
      "sender": "lightningbot",
      "payload": "Meeting started Thu Jan  3 19:01:48 2019 UTC.  The chair is wumpus. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:01:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e05f56e767594e9ebb40b08863548e3f",
      "sender": "lightningbot",
      "payload": "Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:01:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "683d09e49f5a4574bdc814d8a246b93a",
      "sender": "moneyball",
      "payload": "happy 10 year genesis block",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:01:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "086ade23517b4f92bf4a992206e150eb",
      "sender": "meshcollider",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "15aaec650b724a45bf7dcc7d2bd239e1",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "\\o/",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cd2e602e508a4492b1666abffbc01fe5",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag provoostenator aj Chris_Stewart_5 dongcarl gwillen jamesob ken281221 ryanofsky gleb",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "125c9621cbe5483bb19c325fd931843c",
      "sender": "jamesob",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f2e43b13ab9f43e29b2f2a82dd99c247",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:32+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a3d9528c8f99448898ec24faf5aa158b",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "happy 10 years wumpus, who i assume is satoshi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4d821b7f8ebd4c8f91b62c9de3ab1322",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes \\o/",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a0ad23bf0a9e47bfb5a0244e1eb41c2a",
      "sender": "instagibbs",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "02d9fb134eef40f1a0dbc115a07a3290",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "lol instagibbs",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:02:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "468ad8cd19e94c3cb93b21cd1865ad42",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#topic high priority for review",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:04:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b3eef8508a884e43aaae535635e64f5f",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#11082 #14491 #14941",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4b53b39fa52e43209384300c3471a586",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/11082 | Add new bitcoin_rw.conf file that is used for settings modified by this software itself by luke-jr \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #11082 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1bfee3bbac0d4467a80fe28b5174054e",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14491 | Allow descriptor imports with importmulti by MeshCollider \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14491 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8007a6c5b4df49619ab27e61daa81661",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "are the current PRs",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c9bd747d9ab045e7b6b8c4b237f3c748",
      "sender": "phantomcircuit",
      "payload": "hi",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4bf3d72b432746b48fc9a24debd953f3",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14941 | rpc: Make unloadwallet wait for complete wallet unload by promag \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14941 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7e6beb8b9bc64583b7f887be63a2ecce",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "promag would like to add #14941",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:05:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d91d913de3ab46ce9ab68385ec5559b8",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14941 | rpc: Make unloadwallet wait for complete wallet unload by promag \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14941 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6071ab5529254ddf9091ff189b62b486",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "eh wait, that's already on there?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b9f0327bf2a549749dbf004253381eb6",
      "sender": "jamesob",
      "payload": "can I nominate jimpo's BIP157/8-related PRs that've been hanging out for a while? maybe starting with #14111?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cbabf31109fb427581e6e16843e0a1d3",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14111 | index: Create IndexRunner class for activing indexes. by jimpo \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14111 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9b659a6616e54e2b8e02e96ab5f70be7",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "fanquake added",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1030e0dd3e5e473fb399071d225590ae",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "#15006",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1b7b562653d448d8aac524707c95c25e",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/15006 | Add option to create an encrypted wallet by achow101 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #15006 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:06:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d410fecfcea640e6894c2084219fb243",
      "sender": "jamesob",
      "payload": "also ryanofsky's next step in the process separation project, #14711",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:07:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e260f1a638824f3bb09419cb65a94273",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14711 | Remove uses of chainActive and mapBlockIndex in wallet code by ryanofsky \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14711 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:07:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "58cad74fdc9c448683be68add840ccdc",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "I guess #14938 should go first as 15006 depends on it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:07:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f141065185814beb87aa449965668f5f",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14938 | Support creating an empty wallet by Sjors \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14938 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:07:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d09e4cdb67c04b208f85904a2bdf2ba3",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#14938 first then?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:09:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5565afdfb3384aeb83fcd3ef2d604d6f",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14938 | Support creating an empty wallet by Sjors \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14938 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:09:19+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5ae17f0d6dc8438891a55c5a1578afe8",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "right",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:09:19+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f7b60d601aee4f85a94252fdc5ad1d67",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:09:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ad4c933fefa04205b70726d6995b4807",
      "sender": "jamesob",
      "payload": "oops I'm sorry -- that jimpo PR isn't critical path for BIP157; I meant #14085",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:10:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c017f716ac39492c840e18654564745f",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14085 | index: Fix for indexers skipping genesis block. by jimpo \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14085 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:10:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e3e6b773b19e426f9835156465c1cfa8",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "ok added the mentioned ones",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:10:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6a38529fad964ad1809f9162491a5445",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "jamesob: ok, will replace it then",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:10:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "32ec67d36c164f23b65888af28ebe261",
      "sender": "jamesob",
      "payload": "wumpus: thanks. fwiw ultimately I'm after #14121, but that PR is a dep",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:11:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1245c1e71c4748fc8003e442e69ff9e3",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14121 | Index for BIP 157 block filters by jimpo \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14121 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:11:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "173192557e91445fb8bc904e7a11b80a",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "right, better to put that one then, the idea of high priority for review is PRs that are dependencies of others",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:11:42+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3d5a439d254f4dcdbb3235be777532ad",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/projects/8",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:12:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d671d14669554062a9587e68bd976ba8",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#topic having users create their wallets instead of automatically creating a default wallet (achow101)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:13:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "101357eeccdb4694b116de246e10df38",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "this was discussed briefly when I first mentioned it",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:13:40+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "78741fac176e40f4a0c9cdeed4b40ac9",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I like the concept",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:13:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "68d649eaf56d4b81907efbff8f5c3572",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "the end goal is to make wallets that were \"born encrypted\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:13:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f2a7c6f0e418418981f7dd779c485b5b",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "I suspect it may be confusing to some users",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:14:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "74791b8a6b7b48dc967719cc541af809",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I think both should be possible",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:14:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ed95c239681b4407b2bf08713d856d69",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I don't think it confuses users... we could still trigger the \"create\" wallet process at first launch in the GUI",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:14:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4e82eaacb96e4c49b560f58e61f18de5",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "ideally, if you want the default wallet, that's fine, if you want to create something customized and start with nothing, that should be possible",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:15:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "53e8d8af187d45db8d9d5c442c02a059",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "but that sounds after a lot of configuration options.. do you mean a -nodefaultwallet options?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:15:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "024eaa12dfac44dc9806a2e6ff9864d2",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I think having to set an encryption key at first used has been argued against in the past though",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:15:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c7a20e8aee1a446c8f647127dc3ed8df",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "My idea is to get rid of the default wallet entirely. I don't think there really should be a default wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:16:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cf95ad074a534074b8da665909f0a615",
      "sender": "meshcollider",
      "payload": "Can't a default wallet setup box or something pop up like the datadir one on first launch",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:16:29+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8f7285d69bb648ad8f90fdbfe9d324d0",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "and having the default wallet with createwallet can be confusing. users may mistakenly send things to the default wallet when they meant to use some other wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:16:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0af87149a71b48e4b610a4c69c1730e1",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "meshcollider: exactly; that could be skippable",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:16:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "faeb6fb566234c80bb26eeb051adc290",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I agree... wallets should probably created intentionally since its an important data file",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:16:48+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e00eec7981be4fb1820b59e89d7e2343",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: doing something automatically on first _launch_ would largely defeat the point.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fac5728640a54ea7b48a8e876cc6ea45",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: the behavior I've been recommending is triggering it when the user attempts to get an address.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "816b4e26b95742ddaa72d1a2e812bd5c",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: only in the GUI (wizzard) ....",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e513e1b2eeb542a7abbb9a6a3241c88d",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I think changing this is too late for 0.18",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "eb188426409242ad9444acb692cca31b",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: yes, that still defeats the point.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "55445df45c66463aa8a22e44b36c5de4",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "though I'm not convince... only if we \"confuse\" users with removing the default wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "57c166c6ec7d4f2da8e9937d10a2d701",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: so I investigated the create wallet on use stuff before and I think it would be rather fragile or require a lot more refactoring",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:17:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ec8d8ae8841744898faf4bd320ffcea8",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "But yeah,.. I agree with you gmaxwell",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:18:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a67b90edfb3148fab3cebe52f6a55c5d",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "achow101: But do you not agree that it's the right behavior?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:18:21+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "babf5430457b4c07a56e4a9b8009f188",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: also for rpc clients?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:18:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ec28dc0001444b1d94938ce25d3b6e16",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: yes. but I think that having the user explicitly create the wallet is a suitable replacement too",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:19:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c93d4c5dc9b44726a2c40197d13293bd",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "promag: I have less strong opinions on that, I could go either way.  The RPC can't prompt you to answer more questions (like encryption), while the gui can.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:19:27+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "51217bbd8fbb442da2acc2c588174454",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "but for RPC the client could use createwallet explicitly to create the first wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:19:57+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0808ac15454d4aa88918781848a24b18",
      "sender": "ryanofsky",
      "payload": "Will add my +1 for Greg's idea. I think creating a default wallet when needed is more user friendly.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:19:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d0b8cbfb0312421fbf423de95f92ab86",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "achow101: what exactly does that mean?  do you mean getnewaddress should be missing from the UI otherwise, or it should silently fail?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:20:03+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "b8eb277683fb40a8b4cc7b203bc23d7d",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: I'd love to remove the implicit wallet endpoint",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:20:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ad7e22260fa942409e6462c2487b3801",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "When the wallet is auto-creating when it's needed, there is (probably) no place for additional options",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:20:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "04021931ae0c45a6b9e47fcaee54a3e5",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: i mean that getnewaddress would give you an error saying \"do createwallet first\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:20:46+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "363780b40da14516bf345950478a9c0a",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "achow101: because if the GUI would offer the options but pop up a message, then that could simply start wallet creation: so I don't see where the additional refactoring comes in there for the gui.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:20:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9f6c922f77cc452da8467ea9868ded3a",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "this is similar to say, SQL servers, they don't usually create a default database either but assume the client will create one",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:21:26+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "935ddb47ad0b44d784b27bf99e407e47",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "for RPC that makes perfect sense, for the GUI, I don't know",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:21:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "aeb90cd3c4ea40fa9a991d06dc96297e",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "achow101: not only that imo, all wallet methods",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:22:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cafc3c429e7f423b85d07d4d9e1a1c41",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: in the gui, i imagine it would be like the disablewallet ui but a button that says \"click here to make a wallet\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:22:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0acf7840479c4526b7dd8082029b0a86",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "promag: if the endpoint is gone, then users will just get a command not found. We can do that, but kinda lugly.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:22:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e53dd146ce3241a0a06f91da93b7290a",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "I think the GUI with no wallet will require (decent) refactoring to show the receive tab in order to let the user click on \"new address\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:22:41+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "96e1c267fad946ee82d8c5cf22d2fb64",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "achow101: If it's made conspicious enough, thats fine with me I suppose.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:22:50+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "727de1e079174ace9d66fc89e4bccc9f",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "We just need to be careful to not make the software unusable for new users.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:07+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c27df0196ab740ec9d41097d0c6d97d2",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: that is an implementation detail depending on how it's handled, it could just as well return a message to create a wallet first",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "f4d768674d1c42adad9a2bed186b614f",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "the point is that it's going to be totally obvious that you need to make a new wallet. there shouldn't be any magic in the background",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "98a28bbe7bee4c208123977f7a2b7ecc",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "like they shouldn't have to dig through menus to make expected options appear or anything like that.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "96f7e5b5c93144f78045cc643c7c0006",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Why not do it like other wallets,... if the GUI detects no wallet, allow to load or create a wallet",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:34+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8b760697220a4002b3892f4d1f883409",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: exactly",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:49+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "0c73d4f7cbd8449a8fecc7773bb6bb9d",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "that makes perfect sense for the GUI",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:23:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "960bfe4712b246cb8afc920c6034684f",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: when?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "916b6515ca874eb3a1ea4b16fd22b18f",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "at start, when there's no wallet.dat",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:09+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "dc3f221b4e2c496680ff586663a5e163",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "maybe after the first-launch screen it should open some new wallet wizard with a Skip button",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:12+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "05c535b405cf49eba78131e56d6f9c79",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "When the GUI loads and no wallet has been detected (but was compiled with wallet support)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:19+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "80da623295044a009cf5bab76f619809",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Ask: new / open",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:22+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "936dd48eb24847d3b192a182e3e7297a",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "and no -disablewallet or -nowallet or such was specified",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:24+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c91d9e0afefb41f98e7187b4a4448a1b",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "yes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:30+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "590be4093b1c4ea39b2e90ac760c7e8d",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "The point of not creating the wallet on start is so that the wallet will not be created unencrypted, and also so that you don't end up with a lot of unusued wallet files laying around.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:36+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bf7386c6ff544cf182a9ffb13e262dae",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: right",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:47+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c5cab06c457b4558a825bd611bfb935f",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "that's one advantage of never creating wallet.dat without prompting",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:24:58+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "50382906c96a45e18795fbe6e1f68d7a",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "And you don't prompt for an encrypted key at initial start because users will set something random forget it, then months later send funds to it.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:05+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "294d7c9da1824516a6e60ca21cad64e8",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: that would be part of the ui prompt",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:17+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "fdd48bf399be4f64a52b9d208eecc88a",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "That is a critical point",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e1db7c34909044f9ab7e280e0fcda70d",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: something like what electrum does on its first start",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:31+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "927de54839a3461d90c8026886970866",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "(Electrum insututed a complicated UI flow that forces users to write down a recovery code to address that issue)",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "bc7ad4f110cc4a659b1bb67fcf07ee36",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: actually I'm working on \"File -> Reopen Wallet -> ...\" which requires saving a history.. if this is empty it could prompt the wizard",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:25:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "7c6becde2fc9440c96f059dbe79a9f81",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Electrum is too much handholding IMO",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:26:20+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "17574a31dae24debab4992204fbdbaa2",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "Electrum's behavior was driven by massive amounts of funds loss that happened when prompting users for encryption keys months before using the wallet.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:26:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6c8f64b5e5084638ac8aa3eb942b12d9",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "it'd be possible to skip wallet creation completely",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:27:16+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5bdb803a5d17469fb4b9e90dbc6996dd",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "That would speak for the create-on-first-new-address",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:27:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2788a0ca134c4c93badcf0e6bf965ed8",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "jonasschnelli: or just having a clear create button.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:27:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "5ed861166e80425ea75dfaf624130594",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "as I said earlier, I think the ideal solution would be to just have a button in the main ui that says \"click here to make a wallet\"",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:27:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "1d11bd4ef101471dbe4111dd1c72a0eb",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "Or having error messages on use that tell you to create.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:27:43+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a526777575264e52afad3b1af7497a23",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes that was suggested, show the GUI in zero-wallet mode and have a 'create wallet' mode",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:00+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "94871849873b405cb95033d52bdb254b",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "Though if you are going to have an error message, it could just start the create dialog.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a645973173af47d18c97bd0267783c47",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "button",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:13+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "003a3bb04fe849ffbc193069bff61e7b",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "use the webcam to make the user prove they wrote down the passphrase /s",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:23+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "6c354d6e5e464290b54007319f5bf5cd",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "That sounds okay to me, the implementation just needs to be conspicious.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:28+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "45517482415142abaa66720bbca7e033",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "Ideally the GUI is completely usable (explore) without a wallet... and the wallet is created on first address",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:33+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "061481a5eec44a1a8eb6c832c9e77a98",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "regarding the -wallet arg, should it stay \"load or create\"?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:35+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8d7429316e1f4c82a561f9583eea1ad0",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "luke-jr: doesn't everyone have a sticker over those xD",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "e229a85f06654b2e8de9eeedd8cceed9",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "luke-jr: electrum disables copy/paste and then makes you reenter on another screen. less computer vision required. :P",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:28:52+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "2abb6a81ba344298bf9ba0f1b1a45196",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "promag: probably load or create, maybe introduce a -walletfile that doesn't create?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:29:25+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a5fd17077c2942bf978d38e50ab59e4e",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "and consider depricating the create version later?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:29:45+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "a081905027524e8daebc02d0195c1805",
      "sender": "luke-jr",
      "payload": "gmaxwell: I've always found that super annoying for network passwords (but haven't given it a lot of thought for wallet passphrases, or seeds) since it prevents password management",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:30:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "cbcec8ddbf3841988c3d07f4a7eb69cf",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "promag: imo it should just be a load option. no create",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:30:10+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3bc7ca5f4b9b43ac85b070c24d985e1e",
      "sender": "phantomcircuit",
      "payload": "gmaxwell, i have so many completely empty wallet files backed up it's silly",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:30:38+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "284eb82c3e9c44b9a11bf00f5819162f",
      "sender": "achow101",
      "payload": "promag: maybe even error when the wallet file can't be found to load",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:30:56+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "00eb3606ab614a20882554365b3df9b3",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "achow101: maybe lazy creation - on actual usage?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:31:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "ce8839c35b4244509bc74051327ac9e5",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "I think we're starting to go in circles",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:31:39+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4cb532c45f4e44b1b5d4ac6f3160a405",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "jup",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:31:51+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "382e7299f27148c4940026a94eb34997",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "any other topics?",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:31:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "9570875aa2a34fecbcb3296e40f2e2f7",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "anyway, too late for 0.18, and too many breaking changes",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:32:11+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8079161202c04019ad891ec2b43c9f4f",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes, let's aim to have the creat-with-password RPC in 0.18, but don't change any defaults",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:32:37+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "91ef150adb1547518346b117142b8ed1",
      "sender": "jonasschnelli",
      "payload": "ack",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:32:54+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "c17f3fda04fa4b2eb614c12895216dbd",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "I'd like some feedback here #14941, so far only ryanofsky reviewed",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:34:06+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "8b7497f4490048218246849711a107e3",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14941 | rpc: Make unloadwallet wait for complete wallet unload by promag \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14941 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:34:08+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "4d7fdc8f1e4644debb99bb7c25a995b0",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "#action review #14941",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:34:59+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "38c911078c2f4084b022f8fabaec345f",
      "sender": "gribble",
      "payload": "https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/14941 | rpc: Make unloadwallet wait for complete wallet unload by promag \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 Pull Request #14941 \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 bitcoin/bitcoin \u00c3\u0082\u00c2\u00b7 GitHub",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:35:01+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "3945e3db7b714d078c5905d26212bac3",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "ok if there's no other topics, let's close the meeting early",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:36:15+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "80fbfcc19d8643e69105198a5bfb3e75",
      "sender": "gmaxwell",
      "payload": "achow101: error on failure is nice.",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:36:18+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "37d53f8410d04497b22926e7b9128141",
      "sender": "promag",
      "payload": "o/",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:37:02+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "d4ee5d11ef764a78a6bdbb65558404a6",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "yes, having it wait for the unload before returning is certainly better conceptually, having it asynchronous only causes complexity",
      "action": false,
      "timestamp": "2019-01-03T19:37:44+00:00"
    },
    {
      "id": "38a0911675b74507a40dfbf54332b6f1",
      "sender": "wumpus",
      "payload": "(and indeed, leaves no way to return errors)",
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